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	<title>Comments on: What&#8217;s the Purpose of College?</title>
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	<description>Political Philosophy and Applied Ethics for Regular Folks</description>
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		<title>By: K. Banfield</title>
		<link>http://socratesvotes.com/2009/03/21/whats-the-purpose-of-college/comment-page-1/#comment-7245</link>
		<dc:creator>K. Banfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Sep 2009 19:38:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://socratesvotes.com/?p=556#comment-7245</guid>
		<description>1. First, what’s the purpose of going to college, primarily?

Let me begin with saying that I do not believe that there is a primary reason why people go to college. Every person is an individual and we are each motivated by different things. Personally, I chose to go to school for several reasons. The first reason is that I wanted to better myself. Only one person in my family has ever graduated from college, which influenced me wanting to be successful. The second reason I chose to go to college is job security. As a nursing student, I know that I can get a job anywhere in the Unites States at anytime. Most people do not have that security in their jobs. The final reason I chose to go to college is pressure. Since I was a child I can remember my mother telling me &quot;You&#039;re going to go to college.&quot; She had my future mapped out before I could even walk.  However, I must say that even though I was pressured that was not what made me ultimately choose to go to college. 

2. Second, what’s a college teacher’s job?

I think a college teacher&#039;s job is ultimately to teach us what we need to know in order to finish our degree. I think a lot of student expect college teachers to act like high school teachers and hold our hands and walk us through everything. Sure teachers are supposed to teach us to think individually but in my opinion, college students should already be thinking independently. A college teacher&#039;s job is not to set the course up for an easy A. The course should be set up so that we have to work and learn for that A. It&#039;s not the instructors responsibility for his/her students to pass, it&#039;s the students responsibility.  I have had many different teachers in the three years I have been in college. Ultimately, the type of teacher that I want is someone that teaches me what I need to know and makes me earn my grade, instead of spoon feeding me like a toddler.

3. And last, is operating in a certification-based environment necessarily hostile to teachers who relish sharing their passion, but loathe assigning grades.

Throughout my college experience I have had teachers that gave only three grades per quarter and also teachers that gave tests and quizzes every week along with homework assignments.  In my opinion, I learned the same from both techniques. However, I am the type of person that likes to have my knowledge tested fairly often. I think quizzes every week are a bit unnecessary but teachers that do not quiz or grade often can be easily taken advantage of by students. I don&#039;t think that there is a wrong technique for a teacher to use. Ultimately, it is the teachers decision and the students have to adapt.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1. First, what’s the purpose of going to college, primarily?</p>
<p>Let me begin with saying that I do not believe that there is a primary reason why people go to college. Every person is an individual and we are each motivated by different things. Personally, I chose to go to school for several reasons. The first reason is that I wanted to better myself. Only one person in my family has ever graduated from college, which influenced me wanting to be successful. The second reason I chose to go to college is job security. As a nursing student, I know that I can get a job anywhere in the Unites States at anytime. Most people do not have that security in their jobs. The final reason I chose to go to college is pressure. Since I was a child I can remember my mother telling me &#8220;You&#8217;re going to go to college.&#8221; She had my future mapped out before I could even walk.  However, I must say that even though I was pressured that was not what made me ultimately choose to go to college. </p>
<p>2. Second, what’s a college teacher’s job?</p>
<p>I think a college teacher&#8217;s job is ultimately to teach us what we need to know in order to finish our degree. I think a lot of student expect college teachers to act like high school teachers and hold our hands and walk us through everything. Sure teachers are supposed to teach us to think individually but in my opinion, college students should already be thinking independently. A college teacher&#8217;s job is not to set the course up for an easy A. The course should be set up so that we have to work and learn for that A. It&#8217;s not the instructors responsibility for his/her students to pass, it&#8217;s the students responsibility.  I have had many different teachers in the three years I have been in college. Ultimately, the type of teacher that I want is someone that teaches me what I need to know and makes me earn my grade, instead of spoon feeding me like a toddler.</p>
<p>3. And last, is operating in a certification-based environment necessarily hostile to teachers who relish sharing their passion, but loathe assigning grades.</p>
<p>Throughout my college experience I have had teachers that gave only three grades per quarter and also teachers that gave tests and quizzes every week along with homework assignments.  In my opinion, I learned the same from both techniques. However, I am the type of person that likes to have my knowledge tested fairly often. I think quizzes every week are a bit unnecessary but teachers that do not quiz or grade often can be easily taken advantage of by students. I don&#8217;t think that there is a wrong technique for a teacher to use. Ultimately, it is the teachers decision and the students have to adapt.</p>
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		<title>By: Matt Deaton</title>
		<link>http://socratesvotes.com/2009/03/21/whats-the-purpose-of-college/comment-page-1/#comment-3745</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt Deaton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Jul 2009 01:31:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://socratesvotes.com/?p=556#comment-3745</guid>
		<description>You da man, JimmyJones Soda :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You da man, JimmyJones Soda <img src='http://socratesvotes.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: JimmyJones Soda</title>
		<link>http://socratesvotes.com/2009/03/21/whats-the-purpose-of-college/comment-page-1/#comment-3744</link>
		<dc:creator>JimmyJones Soda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Jul 2009 01:28:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://socratesvotes.com/?p=556#comment-3744</guid>
		<description>1- To get my parents to keep paying my expenses
2- To facilitate #1
3- Yes</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1- To get my parents to keep paying my expenses<br />
2- To facilitate #1<br />
3- Yes</p>
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		<title>By: Spencer Hassler</title>
		<link>http://socratesvotes.com/2009/03/21/whats-the-purpose-of-college/comment-page-1/#comment-3736</link>
		<dc:creator>Spencer Hassler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 18:04:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://socratesvotes.com/?p=556#comment-3736</guid>
		<description>I feel college education is viable for us, whether we get good grades or not. Yes, it does matter to those who may want to get into med. school, law,etc. or any of the like. But what college really boils down to is effort and yes some gifted intelligence. It is really up to the person if they want good grades or not because you definitely have the time allotted to you. But some may simply go out and enjoy the party atmosphere, that we all know is a big part of college. That, being said would you want someone with a 3.0 with a few beers and social skills under their belt or someone with a 4.0 with hardly any, but a 4.0 with a little bit of everything is thoroughly impressive. Overall it is up to you to have a good relationship with you professor whether you like them or not. Therefore, I feel the purpose of college, which I feel is a very good thing, is up to the person to determine regardless of any external circumstances.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I feel college education is viable for us, whether we get good grades or not. Yes, it does matter to those who may want to get into med. school, law,etc. or any of the like. But what college really boils down to is effort and yes some gifted intelligence. It is really up to the person if they want good grades or not because you definitely have the time allotted to you. But some may simply go out and enjoy the party atmosphere, that we all know is a big part of college. That, being said would you want someone with a 3.0 with a few beers and social skills under their belt or someone with a 4.0 with hardly any, but a 4.0 with a little bit of everything is thoroughly impressive. Overall it is up to you to have a good relationship with you professor whether you like them or not. Therefore, I feel the purpose of college, which I feel is a very good thing, is up to the person to determine regardless of any external circumstances.</p>
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		<title>By: J. Sokol</title>
		<link>http://socratesvotes.com/2009/03/21/whats-the-purpose-of-college/comment-page-1/#comment-3667</link>
		<dc:creator>J. Sokol</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Jun 2009 03:49:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://socratesvotes.com/?p=556#comment-3667</guid>
		<description>I think that the primary reasons people go to college these days is to get a degree that will allow them to have job security.  In today&#039;s economy it is becoming harder and harder to find or keep a job unless you work in a fied that is in high demand.  I would like to say that getting a college degree is primarily sought after because of a thirst for knowledge and overall love of learning but thats not the case.  I have already gotten a degree and realized that many of the things I found interesting in school I could have done that research on my own.  In some cases I have.  

The truth lies in the economy and more specifically the workforce.  It is almost impossible to get a job without a college degree.  I work at a hospital and even the lowest paying jobs, which requires the least experience want people with a bachelor&#039;s degree.  It&#039;s a racket.  Its just another way for colleges to make money even if the person seeking the degree can not find a job or finds a low paying job.

I&#039;m not sure if this should be the individual professor&#039;s responsibility or not, but it should be the schools responsibility to offer up programs that place students with jobs once they graduate.  This may mean that a school needs to look at the job market and keep their programs up to date with what the job market is looking for.  UT has not done this.  They cut funding to all their programs rather than cutting funding from programs that aren&#039;t producing.  The UT nursing department is a perfect example of a program that is producing what society needs, Nurses, yet UT cut the program in half.  Maybe we don&#039;t need that many fine arts majors as we do nursing majors. I love art as much as the next guy but I prefer to have an in tact nursing program next door.  

As far as grades ar concerned.  I believe we rely on them too heavily.  I think that in most cases where I earned a C in a class I learned way more than my grade reflected.  Unfortunately what is in my head doesn&#039;t matter when it&#039;s time to apply to grad school or potential jobs.  That little letter amongst many other little letter&#039;s in my transcript is what counts.  Maybe if more teachers took into account some of the effort a student puts into the work and added that to the grade it may help.  However, I like earning my grades not having them handed to me.  It&#039;s really a delicate balance.  I think students today forget they have to do the majority of the work to get the grade they want.  Perhaps that has something to do with a societal allowance to feel entitled.  Afterall, most American&#039;s think that the government should give us free healthcare, bail out major companies like AIG, GM, ect...  We forget that we can help ourselves too, it&#039;s just that it takes so much time and effort.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that the primary reasons people go to college these days is to get a degree that will allow them to have job security.  In today&#8217;s economy it is becoming harder and harder to find or keep a job unless you work in a fied that is in high demand.  I would like to say that getting a college degree is primarily sought after because of a thirst for knowledge and overall love of learning but thats not the case.  I have already gotten a degree and realized that many of the things I found interesting in school I could have done that research on my own.  In some cases I have.  </p>
<p>The truth lies in the economy and more specifically the workforce.  It is almost impossible to get a job without a college degree.  I work at a hospital and even the lowest paying jobs, which requires the least experience want people with a bachelor&#8217;s degree.  It&#8217;s a racket.  Its just another way for colleges to make money even if the person seeking the degree can not find a job or finds a low paying job.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not sure if this should be the individual professor&#8217;s responsibility or not, but it should be the schools responsibility to offer up programs that place students with jobs once they graduate.  This may mean that a school needs to look at the job market and keep their programs up to date with what the job market is looking for.  UT has not done this.  They cut funding to all their programs rather than cutting funding from programs that aren&#8217;t producing.  The UT nursing department is a perfect example of a program that is producing what society needs, Nurses, yet UT cut the program in half.  Maybe we don&#8217;t need that many fine arts majors as we do nursing majors. I love art as much as the next guy but I prefer to have an in tact nursing program next door.  </p>
<p>As far as grades ar concerned.  I believe we rely on them too heavily.  I think that in most cases where I earned a C in a class I learned way more than my grade reflected.  Unfortunately what is in my head doesn&#8217;t matter when it&#8217;s time to apply to grad school or potential jobs.  That little letter amongst many other little letter&#8217;s in my transcript is what counts.  Maybe if more teachers took into account some of the effort a student puts into the work and added that to the grade it may help.  However, I like earning my grades not having them handed to me.  It&#8217;s really a delicate balance.  I think students today forget they have to do the majority of the work to get the grade they want.  Perhaps that has something to do with a societal allowance to feel entitled.  Afterall, most American&#8217;s think that the government should give us free healthcare, bail out major companies like AIG, GM, ect&#8230;  We forget that we can help ourselves too, it&#8217;s just that it takes so much time and effort.</p>
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		<title>By: E Valentine</title>
		<link>http://socratesvotes.com/2009/03/21/whats-the-purpose-of-college/comment-page-1/#comment-3620</link>
		<dc:creator>E Valentine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 May 2009 00:29:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://socratesvotes.com/?p=556#comment-3620</guid>
		<description>1.	First, what’s the purpose of going to college, primarily?
  
For my first college experience I attended Pellissippi State straight out of high school. I believe this was purely pressure from parents, guidance counselors, and friends. I would also say that my personal reason at the time for attending college was only to say “Yeah, I’m in college,” like it was cliché or something. Actually, I never completed a single semester at Pelllissippi State. It definitely wasn’t because I wasn’t smart enough. Furthermore, I had just moved out on my own with a roommate. Big mistake. I like many, had too many freedoms and too many responsibilities at the same time. After being in the workforce a few years as a “college dropout”, having some really bad bosses, and having too much fun at times, I realized I wanted something different for myself. Individuals measure their self worth in many ways and up until I started college for the second time I was measuring my self-worth in all the wrong ways. Even now when I am about to graduate I look to my friends that have not gone to school. I see those individuals working crappy hours in a factory and having their hours cut. I am so glad I made the decision to go back to school. I now measure my self-worth by setting and accomplishing goals. I really believe reasons for going to college depend on the maturity level and life experiences of the individual attending college. 

2.	Second, what’s a college teacher’s job? 

I have had several types of college teachers. I have had those who practically give out A’s and whose classes are boring and thoughtless. I have also had teachers whose expectations are unattainable and classes are not enlightening. I have also had teachers who raise the bar, but give opportunity to “earn” your grade and equally “blow your mind.”  Although it would be easy to say “Give me the teacher with the easy A!” I know that my education is expensive and when I am in my career I want to be as knowledgeable as possible. Just a thought- Do you want the MD who had the easy A teacher? No way. I also do not like the teacher that has unrealistic expectations and is not enlightening. A real waste of time and brain space. Especially in the quarter system it is important for the teacher to raise the bar, but have realistic expectations. Information needs to necessarily be condensed and focus on knowledge that will help the students in the real world. Information that will make them valuable or a better person (i.e. thinker). As for the question “Is the professor’s job to bring the slower students up to speed or to filter them out?” Well, when you pay tuition for a private, accredited college and the student is sold on the idea of “smaller classes” and “more personal attention” I believe it is the teacher’s job to make sure the values of the institution they are teaching at are upheld. A teacher simply allowing their time outside of the classroom to help a student that is failing to grasp the material is great. It is the reason I attend the college that I attend. Most of the students at my college work full time jobs and have families. Some have not been to school in many years. The teacher also needs to consider the culture of the college that he/she teaches at. The bottom line- A hand up, not a hand out. 

3.	And last, is operating in a certification-based environment necessarily hostile to teachers who relish sharing their passion, but loathe assigning grades–

Well, grades are necessary. Some courses are harder to assign a grade. Such a course is Art. Some may have a natural aptitude for producing art and some may only be able to produce stick figures. However, what if the stick figure students have come a really long way and have worked harder than the Picassos? A teacher conducts their classroom and administers grades as they so see fit. If they want to concentrate on sharing their passion rather than making sure every multiple choice questions are answered correctly, the teacher can always put more emphasis on a class participation grade.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1.	First, what’s the purpose of going to college, primarily?</p>
<p>For my first college experience I attended Pellissippi State straight out of high school. I believe this was purely pressure from parents, guidance counselors, and friends. I would also say that my personal reason at the time for attending college was only to say “Yeah, I’m in college,” like it was cliché or something. Actually, I never completed a single semester at Pelllissippi State. It definitely wasn’t because I wasn’t smart enough. Furthermore, I had just moved out on my own with a roommate. Big mistake. I like many, had too many freedoms and too many responsibilities at the same time. After being in the workforce a few years as a “college dropout”, having some really bad bosses, and having too much fun at times, I realized I wanted something different for myself. Individuals measure their self worth in many ways and up until I started college for the second time I was measuring my self-worth in all the wrong ways. Even now when I am about to graduate I look to my friends that have not gone to school. I see those individuals working crappy hours in a factory and having their hours cut. I am so glad I made the decision to go back to school. I now measure my self-worth by setting and accomplishing goals. I really believe reasons for going to college depend on the maturity level and life experiences of the individual attending college. </p>
<p>2.	Second, what’s a college teacher’s job? </p>
<p>I have had several types of college teachers. I have had those who practically give out A’s and whose classes are boring and thoughtless. I have also had teachers whose expectations are unattainable and classes are not enlightening. I have also had teachers who raise the bar, but give opportunity to “earn” your grade and equally “blow your mind.”  Although it would be easy to say “Give me the teacher with the easy A!” I know that my education is expensive and when I am in my career I want to be as knowledgeable as possible. Just a thought- Do you want the MD who had the easy A teacher? No way. I also do not like the teacher that has unrealistic expectations and is not enlightening. A real waste of time and brain space. Especially in the quarter system it is important for the teacher to raise the bar, but have realistic expectations. Information needs to necessarily be condensed and focus on knowledge that will help the students in the real world. Information that will make them valuable or a better person (i.e. thinker). As for the question “Is the professor’s job to bring the slower students up to speed or to filter them out?” Well, when you pay tuition for a private, accredited college and the student is sold on the idea of “smaller classes” and “more personal attention” I believe it is the teacher’s job to make sure the values of the institution they are teaching at are upheld. A teacher simply allowing their time outside of the classroom to help a student that is failing to grasp the material is great. It is the reason I attend the college that I attend. Most of the students at my college work full time jobs and have families. Some have not been to school in many years. The teacher also needs to consider the culture of the college that he/she teaches at. The bottom line- A hand up, not a hand out. </p>
<p>3.	And last, is operating in a certification-based environment necessarily hostile to teachers who relish sharing their passion, but loathe assigning grades–</p>
<p>Well, grades are necessary. Some courses are harder to assign a grade. Such a course is Art. Some may have a natural aptitude for producing art and some may only be able to produce stick figures. However, what if the stick figure students have come a really long way and have worked harder than the Picassos? A teacher conducts their classroom and administers grades as they so see fit. If they want to concentrate on sharing their passion rather than making sure every multiple choice questions are answered correctly, the teacher can always put more emphasis on a class participation grade.</p>
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		<title>By: Ed Gonzalez</title>
		<link>http://socratesvotes.com/2009/03/21/whats-the-purpose-of-college/comment-page-1/#comment-2108</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed Gonzalez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Apr 2009 05:16:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://socratesvotes.com/?p=556#comment-2108</guid>
		<description>All opinions expressed in this comment are mine and are not intended to reflect the opinions of any onions, my dog, employers, universities, or celebrities.

&lt;b&gt;What’s the purpose of going to college, primarily?&lt;/b&gt;

When I first went to college in 1994, I went because that was what I was suppose to do.  I wanted to fulfill my destiny and learn a lot along the way.  I left two years later, when I realized no one know what I was suppose to do, not even me.

A while later I returned to college.  I did this because I had worked as a menial laborer and realized that I could be comfortable, but not content in that work.  I wanted to be a something more, but I had no idea what that was.  I, eventually, realized that I wanted to be a computer programmer.  I left school again in 2000 when I was offered a job as a professional software developer.

I came back after I was laid off in 2004.  I returned this time to earn a BS in computer science, because that would open a lot of doors for me.  I left with a BS in computer science and started work immediately.

I came back again, recently, to earn a MS.  I want to do more technical work.  Having a degree and certain knowledge is essential to achieve that goal.  I came back, primarily, for the degree.  I seek the degree because I want more intellectually challenging work.

I tell you all this to say my purpose for going to college has varied.  At first, I wanted to appease family, then open up possibilities, then earn a degree for a position.  It was when my purpose became earning a specific degree that things seemed to fall in place for me. 

When I clarified my purpose into &#039;earning a degree&#039; is when college became tolerable, if not fun.  Mind you, I had fun before, but at the expense of my studies not because of my studies.  I think the reason an individual comes to college depends on that individual.  I believe colleges exists to sell degrees (some restrictions apply, offer not valid in all states).


&lt;b&gt;What’s a college teacher’s job?&lt;/b&gt;

Teachers exist to ensure the exclusivity and worthiness of a particular institution&#039;s degrees.  Some teachers spend their time in research, maybe teaching a class if needed.  These &#039;research teachers&#039; exist to add credibility to the institution in the form of publications, field recognition, patents, etc. Teachers can exist to teach students so that they have a minimal level of knowledge, ensuring that employers can trust in the capabilities of the institution&#039;s students.  Grades are used in ensuring an employers expectation of competency. 

Teachers can take enjoyment in conferring ideas, encouraging thoughtfulness, lively discourse.  However, these are ancillary to the task and not the job for which a professor is hired.  To underscore this point, I asked one professor about a class on software design patterns.  He mentioned that he taught one once and it was the most fun he had.  The topic was pragmatic and interesting, the book was well written, lecture time was spent discussing the merits and particulars of patterns, instead of regurgitating info.  The class was pulled, due to time constraints.  The institution deemed that his time was better spent elsewhere.

For what it&#039;s worth, I prefer the professor who blows my mind.  I consider cake-walk classes a waste of my time and money.


&lt;b&gt;Is operating in a certification-based environment necessarily hostile...&lt;/b&gt;

No, but I bet it can be damned frustrating.  I don&#039;t have much experience here.  I can relate it to developing software in an environment that cares for rapid development at the expense of good design.  Where care fore good design is analogous to care for discipline and care rapid development is care for graded assessment.

In my experience, I can have good design and rapid development at times.  I&#039;ve been able to demonstrate where good design leads to rapid development.  Similarly, I expect a teacher who cares for one&#039;s discipline tends to have students who get better grades.  I expect this because they are either inspired by the teacher&#039;s passion, or at a minimum not put off by the teacher&#039;s disinterest in class.

However, good design and rapid development do come into conflict at times.  Especially when the project can&#039;t afford to lose time in order to get the team informed on a particular technique.  Here I hope the analogy still holds.  Care for one&#039;s discipline can come into conflict with the need to move on and test, instead of recovering or re-examining a subject.  There is only so much time in a semester, and in order to ensure a base level of competency, a teacher must cover a particular set of subjects for a class.  We can argue that not re-examining the subject will leave some students deficient in this area.  I really don&#039;t know what the best thing to do here is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All opinions expressed in this comment are mine and are not intended to reflect the opinions of any onions, my dog, employers, universities, or celebrities.</p>
<p><b>What’s the purpose of going to college, primarily?</b></p>
<p>When I first went to college in 1994, I went because that was what I was suppose to do.  I wanted to fulfill my destiny and learn a lot along the way.  I left two years later, when I realized no one know what I was suppose to do, not even me.</p>
<p>A while later I returned to college.  I did this because I had worked as a menial laborer and realized that I could be comfortable, but not content in that work.  I wanted to be a something more, but I had no idea what that was.  I, eventually, realized that I wanted to be a computer programmer.  I left school again in 2000 when I was offered a job as a professional software developer.</p>
<p>I came back after I was laid off in 2004.  I returned this time to earn a BS in computer science, because that would open a lot of doors for me.  I left with a BS in computer science and started work immediately.</p>
<p>I came back again, recently, to earn a MS.  I want to do more technical work.  Having a degree and certain knowledge is essential to achieve that goal.  I came back, primarily, for the degree.  I seek the degree because I want more intellectually challenging work.</p>
<p>I tell you all this to say my purpose for going to college has varied.  At first, I wanted to appease family, then open up possibilities, then earn a degree for a position.  It was when my purpose became earning a specific degree that things seemed to fall in place for me. </p>
<p>When I clarified my purpose into &#8216;earning a degree&#8217; is when college became tolerable, if not fun.  Mind you, I had fun before, but at the expense of my studies not because of my studies.  I think the reason an individual comes to college depends on that individual.  I believe colleges exists to sell degrees (some restrictions apply, offer not valid in all states).</p>
<p><b>What’s a college teacher’s job?</b></p>
<p>Teachers exist to ensure the exclusivity and worthiness of a particular institution&#8217;s degrees.  Some teachers spend their time in research, maybe teaching a class if needed.  These &#8216;research teachers&#8217; exist to add credibility to the institution in the form of publications, field recognition, patents, etc. Teachers can exist to teach students so that they have a minimal level of knowledge, ensuring that employers can trust in the capabilities of the institution&#8217;s students.  Grades are used in ensuring an employers expectation of competency. </p>
<p>Teachers can take enjoyment in conferring ideas, encouraging thoughtfulness, lively discourse.  However, these are ancillary to the task and not the job for which a professor is hired.  To underscore this point, I asked one professor about a class on software design patterns.  He mentioned that he taught one once and it was the most fun he had.  The topic was pragmatic and interesting, the book was well written, lecture time was spent discussing the merits and particulars of patterns, instead of regurgitating info.  The class was pulled, due to time constraints.  The institution deemed that his time was better spent elsewhere.</p>
<p>For what it&#8217;s worth, I prefer the professor who blows my mind.  I consider cake-walk classes a waste of my time and money.</p>
<p><b>Is operating in a certification-based environment necessarily hostile&#8230;</b></p>
<p>No, but I bet it can be damned frustrating.  I don&#8217;t have much experience here.  I can relate it to developing software in an environment that cares for rapid development at the expense of good design.  Where care fore good design is analogous to care for discipline and care rapid development is care for graded assessment.</p>
<p>In my experience, I can have good design and rapid development at times.  I&#8217;ve been able to demonstrate where good design leads to rapid development.  Similarly, I expect a teacher who cares for one&#8217;s discipline tends to have students who get better grades.  I expect this because they are either inspired by the teacher&#8217;s passion, or at a minimum not put off by the teacher&#8217;s disinterest in class.</p>
<p>However, good design and rapid development do come into conflict at times.  Especially when the project can&#8217;t afford to lose time in order to get the team informed on a particular technique.  Here I hope the analogy still holds.  Care for one&#8217;s discipline can come into conflict with the need to move on and test, instead of recovering or re-examining a subject.  There is only so much time in a semester, and in order to ensure a base level of competency, a teacher must cover a particular set of subjects for a class.  We can argue that not re-examining the subject will leave some students deficient in this area.  I really don&#8217;t know what the best thing to do here is.</p>
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		<title>By: Court Lewis</title>
		<link>http://socratesvotes.com/2009/03/21/whats-the-purpose-of-college/comment-page-1/#comment-1722</link>
		<dc:creator>Court Lewis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 21:10:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://socratesvotes.com/?p=556#comment-1722</guid>
		<description>I meant to comment on this earlier, but I was busy &quot;teaching.&quot;  I think some of the concepts you mentioned should probably be teased apart.  Some of my best and brightest students don&#039;t make the highest grades, which implies they aren&#039;t the best and brightest.  I, however, don&#039;t buy this reasoning.  I finished my first philosophy class with a D-; I had other priorities, but I still learned a lot.  It stuck with me, and after six years I went back and changed the D- to an A.

I guess what I&#039;m trying to say is, there are different types of education; the type that is concerned with grades, the type that is concerned with development, and (along with others) the type that is concerned with professing something - not teaching it.  I see the highest goal of education, and I think this is what Socrates was getting at, is to teach people how to think for themselves.  This doesn&#039;t involve grades, jobs, dipolomas, or anything else.  As teachers, we might not ever know whether we are effective or not.  Telling people how to think is not teaching, it&#039;s indoctrination; telling people how to think is the first step to wisdom.

I feel like I rambled; sorry, if I did</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I meant to comment on this earlier, but I was busy &#8220;teaching.&#8221;  I think some of the concepts you mentioned should probably be teased apart.  Some of my best and brightest students don&#8217;t make the highest grades, which implies they aren&#8217;t the best and brightest.  I, however, don&#8217;t buy this reasoning.  I finished my first philosophy class with a D-; I had other priorities, but I still learned a lot.  It stuck with me, and after six years I went back and changed the D- to an A.</p>
<p>I guess what I&#8217;m trying to say is, there are different types of education; the type that is concerned with grades, the type that is concerned with development, and (along with others) the type that is concerned with professing something &#8211; not teaching it.  I see the highest goal of education, and I think this is what Socrates was getting at, is to teach people how to think for themselves.  This doesn&#8217;t involve grades, jobs, dipolomas, or anything else.  As teachers, we might not ever know whether we are effective or not.  Telling people how to think is not teaching, it&#8217;s indoctrination; telling people how to think is the first step to wisdom.</p>
<p>I feel like I rambled; sorry, if I did</p>
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